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Final 2 fixtures need updating.

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We were defending like the Alamo before 72 minutes. None of what I am saying is to excuse Tuchel. He shouldn’t be making these comments publicly, nor should he have leaned into negative tactics by bringing more defenders on. He shoulders a large portion of responsibility. However, this kind of mentality has shown its head time and time again under different managers, so I don’t think it’s all down to that. It is Tuchel’s job to coach that out of them, however.

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Awaywego wrote:

AB will have watched and have seen and heard TT doubling down defending his tactics.
What do fans know about football at best they’ve managed under 14 kids teams.

To be fair, I think there is some truth in what Tuchel said. The retreat to defending like the Alamo has happened under more than one manager, so while I don’t think Tuchel helped with those subs and found little success in pushing them up, I think mentality needs to change. It’s like our players are geared to thinking “now to see it out” at 1-0 and I think this has been instilled by more than Tuchel. To learn from this, the FA needs to look at how to coach this out of them during the youth level and maybe, in time, we can go to the next step.

The positives are that we can now regularly make it far in tournaments, so something is going right, and we can say we are among the best in the world (if not quite yet the best). It’s not like the overhyped 20 year ago team, we are a force to be reckoned with and proved that for 60 minutes against Argentina.

During the end of Sotuhgate’s reign, the Southgate fans were saying the players weren’t good enough and we could only go far because of him, while Southgate’s detractors said the players were the best and his tactics let us down. I think the reality is in between. We do have good players and a good squad, but not quite the best, so they deserve respect while recognition that we need to change something to go that one better.

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Overall, I think that’s a good thing. More choice the better for me.

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I think Klopp will be off to manage Germany.

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Ultimately, we can look back and say we are a top 4 side, but it was the manner of defeat yesterday that sticks in my craw. After Italy in 2021 I felt that was when I knew Southgate didn’t have the tactical nous to win against top opposition and I expected Tuchel to be better, given he was brought in to bring that element to the team. However, yesterday was every bit as bad for poor game management. Up until we scored I thought it was an even game and it could go either way. Argentina were always going to push for it, so some defending capabilities were expected, but those decisions to put more defenders on just invited pressure to a team who knows how to come from behind. Egypt tried and failed, Switzerland were maybe forced into it somewhat with the 10 men, but tried and failed. So we look at that and try again, but with zero attacking outlets at all. Madness. If we had the game plan of the first 55 minutes we may still have lost, but at least it would have been giving it our all. That feels now like a what could have been. Tuchel overthought it and tried to be too clever in nullifying Argentina.

I don’t want to go on to the manager’s head; he’s achieved as much as Southgate has in the world cup (and I don’t mean that as a slight against Southgate) and we gave Southgate more chances, while Tuchel has had success. I feel those who praised Southgate for getting us far can’t criticise Tuchel whose failure was similar to Southgate’s, while still pushing us far. However, people are saying who else is there. Well, there is a Pep Guardiola available. He has little else to prove at club level, the FA could say “you have achieved so much, winning an international tournament will cement you as the best manager ever” and Pep reportedly likes living in England. I am not saying we should go for him and backstab Tuchel, just pointing out there is a good manager who might take it.

Oh well, at least I will get 12 points from yesterday’s game in the prediction league.

2 users thanked author for this post.

alcazar, Awaywego

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Unfortunately irony will be missed by some unless there’s a whopping crying with laughter face emoji at the end of each sentence.

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It’s good to see remarks that acknowledge that the UK has things to be proud of. It’s a common belief among the right that liberals and the left don’t like the country and that stereotype comes from mocking ‘flag shaggers’ for expressions of patriotic pride. Like when Emily Thornberry mocked a white van man for adorning his house with England flags a decade ago. I don’t like the unite the Kingdom activists and think many have bad motives, but to many, criticism will fall on deaf ears when much of it seemed to damn the flag itself. To me, the UK is great because we are a country that has progressed so much with gay rights, women’s rights, rights for black people and so on. We have shown great values where there has been assimilation and people can be seen as welcome no matter their sexuality or ethnicity. Not everyone is so welcoming, but we’ve done a better job than many nations.

None of this means the country has had a spotless past or present; there are creeping issues today with a growing intolerance and we made many historical mistakes that harmed others. However, no country has a record with few blemishes and we have done something to acknowledge our past (more than what can be said for Japan, Turkey or Russia, who have had worse records at times).

I think some liberals cringe at patriotic pride because it seems burlish and putting oneself above others, but I think it is healthy to have a pride in where you’re from. Why bother improving the country if you think it has no merit? It doesn’t mean you need to tip into jingoism – every country has positives and negatives, but looking at the good points and having pride shouldn’t be taboo. The French seem to manage it from all sides of their politics, so we can too, surely.

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That’s 2 world cup semi finals out of 3 and 2 successive Euro finals. While we have had our fortune, few teams don’t when reaching this stage, and that consistent level of progression in tournaments shows we have something. Under 2 different managers now, so it cannot be put down to just the manager.

We missed Rice when he came off, but it all worked out. No yellows for him and Bellingham. I was worried about that, but I felt the ref did a good job in letting the game flow and all major decisions were correct.

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alcazar

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64 wrote:

When do you consider it was once great?
Our much revered royals sell their daughters for influence,politicians have traditionally connived and murdered their way to the top.We celebrate it too. Perhaps the vile woman will get a statue along with the slave traders and pirates that made it a once great country

Widdecombe held some archaic and, in my opinion, bigoted views. However, there is a world of difference between her and a slave trader or pirate.

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Maybe Positivity Dave will be signing a contract to exclusively post on the iron insider forum, when that comes out, given he is now the communication outlet for the club.

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A title for Fiddlers Elbow.

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He must be. I was thinking of Obertan, but got mixed up.

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I think Egypt had tired out.

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The problem is now that every VAR decision will be questioned for corruption and will be seen with more weight than before, including that bizarre disallowed goal. A foul ages before is now in the remit of VAR apparently.

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Who will play alongside him? Jonjo Shelvey, Luke Chadwick, Eric Djemba Djemba and Bebe?

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Is there any Trump intervention that doesn’t lead to catastrophic failure for the USA? Tariffs, Ukraine talks, Iran and now this. It’s a shame because those here were actually enjoying the USA, but it will now be remembered for them and FIFA being corrupt.

It wasn’t the only reason, but I think this put a lot of pressure on the team, who looked like rabbits in headlights at times.

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Iron Age wrote:

Do we need any more evidence of the corruption of Infantino, FIFA and Trump after the unbanning of the US’s top player?

Trump confirms it now and FIFA have opened a huge can of worms. The attorney general for the UK has opened the door in speaking to FIFA about overturning Quansah’s red card, citing the Trump talk and FIFA response. France have done the same in trying to get Olise’s yellow card overturned from the Paraguay game.

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What a win, what a performance. I get that performances have not been great against Panama and DR of Congo, but we need to give these teams credit. It isn’t the world cup of 30 years ago; these teams are more of a challenge and we aren’t the only ones to have struggled. Germany lost to Paraguay, Spain and Argentina struggled against Cape Verde, Brazil lost to Norway. Ultimately, our quality shone through and Tuchel made the right tactical and strategical decisions against DR of Congo and Mexico. The right substitutions, the right changes of shape and he appears to love the job, which is more than what could have been said for Capello. Southgate was a good man manager, he changed the ethos of the England camp, but he was lacking strategically. If Southgate was manager, I wouldn’t have been surprised if we had lost against Mexico for that reason, so I am happy having a coach who can manage the game better and still have that same team spirit.

People have criticised England and expect little based off the failed, egotistical ‘golden generation’ and the weak squad from 2010-2018, but this England is different. They showed it under Southgate, and they showed it yesterday – that they do have pride in the shirt, which is more than what could be said for Rooney, Lampard, Ferdinand et al. It doesn’t mean we are bound to win the world cup, Norway will be a tough proposition, but we can surely have some pride in our team and think we can have a chance of winning against whoever we play.

1 user thanked author for this post.

BigLeftToe

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Game of the tournament so far. Unbelievable from Cabo Verde. To play so well and make Argentina sweat when they have a population of Sheffield. I hope the players wake up tomorrow and are proud of their performance. Drawing with Spain was something, but that will be forever remembered.

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Iron-awe

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There are many things I don’t like about the club’s handling of communication with fans and the money making schemes are becoming too exploitative, but I prefer this to the dying embers of Swann and the farce of dodgy Dave’s conning run.

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Reminiscent of the Slovakia game last Euros. Only our defence looks weaker now.

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No, I don’t want the club dead.

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Gratuity fees being added to kiosks. 20% tip for an ovepriced coke.

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There were some among the Strasser faction who had aspects that fit with a more socialist angle when it came to economics. All were purged in the Night of Long Knives and any resemblance to socialism was lost after that, where Hitler loathed actual socialism and socialists. The name was useful for PR and propaganda for disaffected Germans.

In the end, the Nazis were as socialist as the Democratic People’s Republic of Korea is a democracy.

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Not impressed with the running from the press and much was made about Starmer not delivering on manifesto pledges, but when did anyone vote on anything Burnham puts forward? Some of it may sound good, but it all sounds utopian and after Starmer gets railed by the press for not delivering in 2 years, I don’t think his 10 year plan will get any patience and he would reap what he has sowed there, given his own undermining.

Not sure how a number 10 in the north would work. There would be a lot of time needed for it to happen, with the civil service roles being moved there. Sounds like a soundbyte to me and wouldn’t be surprised if it gets dropped.

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We haven’t looked convincing, but we didn’t last Euros and got to thr final. We aren’t the only ones. Germany aren’t convincing and Spain look just as bad.

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Deereyme66 wrote:

People bigging up the Rolling Stones. Yeah, probably a good live band if you’re in to that stadium shit, but artistically manure. Do one. Music for idiots.

Correction: I do like a few tracks by them but the whole deification of them is unjustified. Some may say that about The Beatles of course but they are either tone deaf or aliens.

I shan’t introduce a friend of mine to you then who thinks they’re the best of all time. He can be quite opinionated too.

Yes, that’s coming from me, but I am a lot more mild in real life, unless I have had a few pints and someone is chatting cobblers. I did have a debate about climate change with someone last summer at a bar (nostalgia for the Bucks days) and he went hone to print off material to try and show I am wrong when he came back. That was enough for me to call the debate off and have it deescalate.

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alcazar wrote:

Can’t remember a wc where most commentators and pundits haven’t fawned over Brazil.
Happening a bit with Argentina and even Portugal now too.

Spain too, but at least with Spain and Argentina they have among the best squads now and have won tournaments recently. Portugal have a good squad, but are hindered by Ronaldo, even though some of the fawning comes from that. I don’t think Ronaldo is ‘back’ because he scored 2 goals against a really bad Uzbekistan. He hindered them last Euros and am not convinced catering for him won’t harm Portugal against better teams.

Pundits seem to live off the past with Brazil. They were great in the past, so we must adore them now. When Germany beat them 7-1 I was in awe of a great German performance and one of the best of this century. Yet, at the end of the game, pundits like Alan Hansen were gloomily proclaiming it as a dark day for football because Brazil got thumped and we all want a great Brazil. If the scores were reversed, I doubt they would mourn the defeat of Germany if scores were reversed.

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alcazar, RedMistTorpsFist

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