[Siderite]

64 wrote:

Awaywego wrote:

See the club ignoring the weather yet again give a preview of the game but no mention of the pitch and wether there having a pitch inspection, guess it must be temperate down there, my grass is rock hard.

All you see is the club not telling you everything they know when you oddly think they should.

I demand a club statement.

[Siderite]

Fine by me as long as he sticks by us and isn’t another Spireiron, flitting from club to club.

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Awaywego

[Siderite]

Iron-awe wrote:

Trump said pre election he was going to to be a dictator from day one and he appears to be carrying that out. His total lack of running the majority of his decisions by congress and the senate and as DM says his disregard for international law are no different to Putin waltzing into Ukraine and saying it’s legitimate, different scale of course but the same principal. Of course his mental deterioration and poor health are probably part and parcel of his decision making but it’s very unnerving for the rest of the world. We were famous for gun boat diplomacy back in our empire days ( another term for bullying others ) and Trump is no different IMO.

I would say that there is quite a bit of difference between what happened in Ukraine and Venezuela. Ukraine has a democratically elected leader, while Venezuela has a dictator who is recognised as illegitimate given he has rigged elections and stayed on despite losing a decade ago.

My own thoughts on this is that, on paper, this could have been defendable on this basis. The removal of a tyrant, who has massacred more dissidents than Pinochet and caused a huge economic slump which has destroyed the country. The problem is that it would be extremely foolish to believe that Trump has done this out of any love for democracy and for Venezuelans. This has been evident in that he has only removed Maduro and left the regime still intact and has been openly saying he would be happy with Venezuela if he can just get money from oil out of it, without a care if Venezuela remains the corrupt, despotic state that it is. Any talk of narcotic sponsoring falls apart when you realise Trump pardoned Hernandez of Honduras, who also has links with narcotics. Any talk of upset at Maduro for being a tyrant falls apart when Trump wanted to remain as leader, despite losing fairly, in 2020 and whipped up a frenzy on Jan 6th 2021 for this. And sources close to the White House have said that Trump didn’t want to work with Machado because she refused to demand that Trump got the Nobel Peace Prize instead of her. Narcisstic moron with the maturity of a toddler.

Moreover, he has now gone along with imperialist mantras that are reminiscent of Putin. If he had kept it as a needed operation to remove a hostile element of the US, who had no legitimacy as leader, it could be sold as something that would be beneficial for Venezuela and its people (even if Trump isn’t exactly some benevolent figure). However, his ego couldn’t stop there. He had to speak of stupidity over some ridiculous ‘Donroe doctrine’ over the Americas and threatening Greenland again. I am convinced he wants Greenland because it looks large on the Mercator projection; all his arguments about security fall apart when you realise the USA has that anyway and the countries Trump says he wants protection from include those he has snuggled up to. All his cyclic, failed (so far) peace attempts for Ukraine have collapsed because he is too eager to just go along with whatever the Kremlin says, and even recently he believed the Putinist nonsense about attacks on Putin’s residence. Never mind that Putin has attempted to capture or kill Zelensky more than once and deliberately attacks civilians, Putin maybe being attacked is what gets Trump upset.

The USA doesn’t realise how much damage it is doing to itself among its allies and too many dismiss it as exagerration. The USA, in this last year, has proven itself so unreliable for any kind of trust. It regularly attacks allies, while cosying up to tyrants, pushes for whatever the tyrant wants in resolving conflicts and makes egregious insults towards Europeans. Europeans have sometimes struggled with free speech, admittedly, but the free speech here is damn more available than elsewhere, who Trump has repeatedly been weak on (having a good laugh with Bin Salman of Saudi over dead journalists and excuses for the Khashoggi killing), while going after those who dare insult him or tried to hold him accountable. Even if he goes in 2028, how can we place long term reliance on a country that could elect a Caligula figure every 4 years? The USA have blown mutual cooperation with them into the water. Tariffs, threats and more mean that Europe, Canada, Japan, South Korea, Taiwan, Australia and the rest of the ‘free world’ cannot rely on them. I don’t say this out of American hatred; I think the USA has been a good superpower to have since WWII compared to the alternatives, but now it is beyond contempt because the senile idiot in charge has meant that we can no longer trust them (and this is without going into the domestic stupidity). For a while, critics said it would be better with a multipolar world, but that is what we have now and look how bad it is. Russia and China have been stirring up trouble for years, but now it has arrived and that means ‘might means right’. Maybe a liberal democratic USA, which was always free market capitalist, but with more respect for rules and order wasn’t so bad after all.

[Siderite]

Happy new year to all and hopefully another memorable year for the Iron to follow.

[Siderite]

Awaywego wrote:

To me chants nowadays are rather tame to what they were when I first started going in the late 60s.
Many were meant to offend so what!

Maybe so, but the problem here for me is the political nature that alienates others among our own fanbase. That is what causes division. If people are going to chant for divisive figures, they should expect people to react negatively to those chants.

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saleiron

[Siderite]

sufc_not_on_tour wrote:

Cliff Byrne’s Right Peg wrote:

The Keir Starmer chant is pretty widespread now; Sky have had to go silent when it’s sung at the darts.

Must admit it was disheartening hearing it at a Scunny game, along with the pro- farage chants. The Tommy Robinson chant was sung by 20-30 young lads behind us, there was an angry response from half a dozen or so Scunny fans and it quickly stopped. I asked a young lad behind us why he was singing it and he didn’t have a clue, seemed embarrassed when confronted about it.

sad state of affairs and hopefully that shite can be self policed.

So, because YOU and the clown who was so upset by it that he felt the need to start threads on the subject insist it should be banned and no doubt think people who feel the need to chant should be silenced by the likes of you pair.
You do realise that is why the chants are sung, because of people like YOU!

People have the right to air dissatisfaction with divisive chants that have nothing to do with football and would alienate part of the fanbase. As long as they aren’t getting stewards to escort fans away for these chants, I don’t think it is censorious. Fans can still ignore these calls to shut up.

[Siderite]

I don’t think we can censor fans for singing a song disparaging the PM. I don’t think Iron Army have done anything untoward in having that aired. However, I’d rather fans didn’t bring such politics into chants. After all, supporting the club should be people for all views and what unites is being a fan of the same club. After all, the same people would say “don’t bring politics into football” if others chanted anything against something they supported.

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saleiron

[Siderite]

You won’t win over many converts with your attitude.

[Siderite]

billpuntonsghost wrote:

I Corinthians 1:18. For the message of the Cross is foolishness to those who are perishing,but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.
The Gospel message is simple,Repent and believe the “ Good News”.
Hope this post is an adequate response to the post by Siderite.

Good grief. I was just posting a merry Christmas message with a fun, quirky song. It wasn’t a cryptic message aimed at getting anyone. Lighten up.

[Siderite]

Merry Christmas to all Iron fans.

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TheJuryeffsOut

[Siderite]

There are still free and fair elections planned for the USA, so I wouldn’t describe him as a dictator. He certainly admires them though and I have no doubt that he would love to be one. He is acting like one, with the austentatious and tacky White House updates, grovelling of underlings and hatred of critical material of his government. They give a pretense of free speech concerns in Europe, but seem more bothered that Kremlin rubbish gets called out as disinformation and he is more than happy palling up to murderers of journalists from Saudi.

[Siderite]

Speaking of affronts to democracy, I see the ‘pro-free speech’ government of the USA are sanctioning bodies and people involved with highlighting disinformation. Apparently free speech does not include highlighting lies and free speech means shutting down those calling out lies.

Maybe the ‘totalitarian Marxist state’ is being brought in by Donald Trump?

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Iron-awe

[Siderite]

When we have a general election by 2029, will you admit you were wrong?

[Siderite]

There will be an election by then. Stop being paranoid.

[Siderite]

It’s ignited a ridiculous civil war among many of the talking heads, where Candace Owens has gone further off the rails and started ranting about how Israel killed Charlie Kirk, did 9/11, the Bondi Beach massacre, the slave trade and more (just swap Jews with Zionists and Israel and they will claim it’s just ‘legitimate criticism’), while spewing neo-Nazi-esque hate about Jews. Ben Shapiro has come out against her, while Tucker Carlson and Megyn Kelly decide there are ‘no enemies on the right’, so refuse to criticise Candace and make out it’s all lies and smears, and they are the victims really because people are upset at them standing with such reprehensible views.

https://x.com/yashar/status/2002177632809726126

Yes, this example isn’t specifically from the Kirk murder, but it was her Charlie Kirk conspiracies that started this spat.

[Siderite]

Finally a cure for my insomnia.

[Siderite]

Sometimes we might overestimate our critical thinking skills, and everyone gets things wrong.

[Siderite]

Aye, but it’s important to remember to self-reflect and think it’s not just those with different opinions who may have gone wayward in opinion. In this age of polarisation, all of us can succumb to tribal views and arguments that sound good because it fits prior beliefs.

[Siderite]

I suspect you will find some sympathy among many Scunny fans given our own recent history. Might be worth reaching out to the Iron Trust on social media too.

I will give something when I can.

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Accies

[Siderite]

They do it through private business? The world isn’t so simple.

[Siderite]

Things like digital face recognition do create worries. The conspiracies come when people talk about totalitarian Marxist one world governments or cabals being behind it and not it being driven by businesses in the west, like tech companies. With shops wanting it to help catch potential shoplifters and banks, among others, to protect from fraud on accounts with them.

[Siderite]

I am willing to bet that general elections will go ahead by 2029 and Starmer will likely be voted out and with minimal foul play. Which would be odd for a totalitarian.

[Siderite]

Northumbiron wrote:

“Consecutive governments”. So nothing to do with Marxist Totalitarianism then?

Given the government have been terrible with communications and formulating any kind of coherent plan and policy to date, I would say it’s more likely that this is because of clumsiness and poorly thought through ideas over clever plots to bring in tyranny, which would probably require a greater degree of competence than what we have witnessed. With the many u-turns and incoherence.

[Siderite]

Yes, I know your claims over more lockdowns (that didn’t happen) were a joke. Now, consider that my original post shows that I am uneasy at the proposals put to change our judicial system and think maybe resorting to snark against someone who might have some agreement in opposition to these changes isn’t maybe the wisest idea.

All you ever do on this board is spoil for a fight to show how ‘right’ you are. Not by any kind of measured debate, but cherry picking and looking for any angle to convince your ego that you ‘won’.

[Siderite]

Snarky comments. That will convince me, I am sure. When are those imminent forever lockdowns coming? You promised them years ago.

[Siderite]

It’s a stupid decision, one of many, from the government which gives ammunition to conspiracy theorists. It’s likely motivated by the mess of the judicial system, with much backlog, but it harms judicial fairness.

[Siderite]

[Siderite]

Butler needs to get a grip of this. Most fans back him and are happy with how he got us promoted and an overall decent season so far. Most aren’t blaming him or player effort for our recent slump.

As long as it isn’t abusive, negative comments are expected, even if some are overly negative at times. But that’s the price for free speech. People should temper themselves if they can, but they shouldn’t be forced to. Gesticulating for fans to go for asinine comments is ridiculous and makes him look bad. It’s the fans’ club as well, even if some might be negative. It doesn’t bode well if things really go awry.

This all said, I am glad he is the manager over an overrated lower non-league manager who tried and failed with a bigger budget. He achieved more with less.

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iron64

[Siderite]

[Siderite]

It’s no more revelling in defeat than criticism of Watson was revelling in him conceding.

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